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Gorge Ban the Bags!
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Nak

Since 19 May 2005
3691 Posts
Camas
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PostFri May 17, 19 3:53 pm     Reply with quote

I can see both sides of this issue. Salmon Slayer has a point that there is a LOT of hypocrisy in the environmental movement. However, just because the "rock stars" the media talks to about the environment are idiots for the most part, that doesn't mean the issues facing us aren't serious.

Politics have successfully been avoided on this forum for quite a while, something that makes me proud to know most of you. The politics of environmentalism are harder to avoid as the environment and kiteboarding are deeply entwined. That said, please, please everyone keep it civil. If you want to change a person's mind while learning something about their position, intelligent discourse is the only way to do it. The moment you insult somebody you only convince them more firmly of the rightness of their own opinion. If you want change, and not just to hear yourself talk, politely make your points. Listen and learn from those that you disagree with. You learn nothing from those you already agree with. Counter their points with logic, and admit when they have a good point. Remember, it's not just the person you're addressing in the forum, it's everyone in the world that reads the exchange.

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jayala

Since 30 Apr 2013
81 Posts
Portland
 



PostFri May 17, 19 7:24 pm    Bags Reply with quote

I am in Thailand now. The wind is weak so I went for a walk. Unfortunately this beach is typical. Zoom in on the attached picture. I appreciate the event site and sand bar.

   Screenshot_20190518-102135_Gallery.jpg 

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fisherman

Since 06 Aug 2007
113 Posts

Stoked



PostSun May 19, 19 3:27 pm    Plastic bag ban nonsense. Reply with quote

I am with Slayer. He is a sober thinker, not an emotional one. I have no idea where Monkeyboy saw plastic bags everywhere. If some of you don't like the plastic don't use it . Be an example for the rest of us. Don't just try to dictate to us how to live our lives. And eliminate the rest of your activities you harm the environment with. Otherwise just shut up. I will stop using plastic bags if people stop putting their filthy reusable bags on the cashiers belt. That puts everyone's health in danger. Before you get so stressed about plastic bags do a little research. There are studies available. For example this one

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2196481

Hey, Monkeyboy, how's the weed business ? How much is an ounce selling for now ? Judging by your intelligent and educated viewpoints on different subjects ( bags or tariffs) you must be smoking your stock often. Maybe the decision to get in this dead end business was made under influence.

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Hein

Since 08 Mar 2005
1223 Posts

Possessed



PostSun May 19, 19 8:40 pm     Reply with quote

https://www.wsj.com/articles/what-if-green-energy-isnt-the-future-11558294830

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ZMar

Since 13 May 2018
13 Posts

 



PostSun May 19, 19 8:47 pm    Re: Plastic bag ban nonsense. Reply with quote

fisherman wrote:
I will stop using plastic bags if people stop putting their filthy reusable bags on the cashiers belt. That puts everyone's health in danger.


This may be a bit of a wild idea but, instead of continuing to create an inordinate amount of plastic waste with an apathetic view of its impact on the environment or the future of the world that we live in, just wash a reusable bag...

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pdxmonkeyboy

Since 16 May 2006
6070 Posts
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PostMon May 20, 19 2:14 pm     Reply with quote

The argument that we shouldn't do anything because we can't solve everything is pretty much the banner of the myopic masses.

If you ever wonder if someone really knows about a subject they are debating, one big clue that they don't actually know Jack shit is if they change the subject to something that is not about the subject at hand. The classic "what about".

Did Trump collude with the Russians? What about Hillary's emails

Is the climate getting warmer? What about the snow on the east coast in march?

If you honestly think that the climate change we are seeing is not because of human activities, you are seriously living in a self imposed information bubble. As if the earth is not a closed system.

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Gman

Since 11 Feb 2006
4788 Posts
Portland
Unstrapped



PostMon May 20, 19 3:26 pm     Reply with quote

SalmonSlayer wrote:
ALL of you can fight the big plastic bag fight, but you are missing the point. It is symbolism over substance. You think you are doing the right thing? In the grand scheme of things it is it is insignificant. Virtue signalling at it's best. Get back to me when you really do something significant. You won't.

I doubt one of you would be willing to live within the carbon footprint of the average human being on earth. You are 1%ers that run around doing more damage to the environment with you elective choices spending your disposable income. But that is different somehow.

As I said, self-awareness score close to ZERO. As long as you feel good about yourself, what else matters? All symbolism over substance.


i plan to live out my days, on a sailboat subsisting on fish i spear and rice (once i figure how to grow rice on a sailboat...)


- not sure how you can argue the banning of plastic bags is symbolic and insignificant, the practice certainly scales, state-wide, nation-wide, every store in the world!

we are fighting for hearts and minds - single-use plastics must go

we successfully kept Nestle out of Cascade Locks

i liked this campaign promoting awareness of the amount of plastic garbage we create daily

https://www.changingtidesfoundation.org/pages/plastic-swear-jar-challenge

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Nak

Since 19 May 2005
3691 Posts
Camas
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PostMon May 20, 19 5:41 pm     Reply with quote

pdxmonkeyboy wrote:

If you ever wonder if someone really knows about a subject they are debating, one big clue that they don't actually know Jack shit is if they change the subject to something that is not about the subject at hand. The classic "what about".


You do know that you just changed the subject to something that is not about the subject at hand? Wink

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pdxmonkeyboy

Since 16 May 2006
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PostMon May 20, 19 6:21 pm     Reply with quote

You should know by now Nak that I am here just to hear myself talk.
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fisherman

Since 06 Aug 2007
113 Posts

Stoked



PostMon May 20, 19 6:39 pm     Reply with quote

And embarrass yourself.

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Nak

Since 19 May 2005
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PostMon May 20, 19 6:45 pm     Reply with quote

No, PDX makes good points; I was just poking fun a bit. I think Gman said it best: "single-use plastics must go" There really isn't a downside, just a few habits that need to change. And certainly American ingenuity can figure out a better way. There's no reason this couldn't end up being "win - win." That's the kind of solution that we can come up with if we all work together. There's no reason "good for the environment" can't also be "good for the economy."

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chrissmack

Since 08 Jun 2005
460 Posts
portland
Obsessed



PostTue May 21, 19 7:32 am    ... Reply with quote

just took my 50 gallon roll cart to the curb for Tuesday garbage collection

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jeremy

Since 18 Aug 2006
243 Posts
Manzanita
Stoked



PostTue May 21, 19 9:10 am     Reply with quote

Yeah, FAKE recycling takes the cake. I just rolled out my blue cart. It will get picked up by the recycling truck and then go to landfill. Apparently there's not enough demand for the stuff in America, wonder why ?

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wylieflyote

Since 30 Jun 2006
1368 Posts
Puget Sound & Wa. Coast
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PostTue May 21, 19 9:39 am     Reply with quote

jeremy wrote:
Yeah, FAKE recycling takes the cake. I just rolled out my blue cart. It will get picked up by the recycling truck and then go to landfill. Apparently there's not enough demand for the stuff in America, wonder why ?


Here in Tacoma we've had just wonderful curb-side recycling for decades. Super easy. But, We received word that this is a thing of the past without more taxation. China has been taking all our recycling (and probably all of yours) for many years and has told the world No More without drastic price increases. I also did not realize until reading China's statement just how dirty our recycled plastic as and what problems that causes.

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Matt V

Since 26 Oct 2014
377 Posts
Summer- OR Coast, Winter - My van near good snow
Explosive Diarrhea



PostTue May 21, 19 3:20 pm     Reply with quote

jeremy wrote:
Yeah, FAKE recycling takes the cake. I just rolled out my blue cart. It will get picked up by the recycling truck and then go to landfill. Apparently there's not enough demand for the stuff in America, wonder why ?


So are you ready to concede that the human race, as a whole, cannot be considered an intelligent species. We cannot even pass the simplest test of "Is the speices in question still repeating the same mistakes it has made before? (yes = not intelligent, no = possibly intelligent)"


And then in another thread, so called environmentalists are complaining about having to pay more for goods from China! HELLO MCFLY, ARE YOU IN THERE!!!!! One of the main factors in Chinese products being so cheap is that there are no environmental restrictions on dumping the waste on the land, in the air, in the rivers, and and on the ocean, that it takes to make these products. So they feel good about supporting "trade" and keeping their backyard clean while the rest of the population of the earth lives in a current, or future Super Fund site.


Wh

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pdxmonkeyboy

Since 16 May 2006
6070 Posts
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PostTue May 21, 19 3:27 pm    Re: Plastic bag ban nonsense. Reply with quote

fisherman wrote:

Hey, Monkeyboy, how's the weed business ? How much is an ounce selling for now ? Judging by your intelligent and educated viewpoints on different subjects ( bags or tariffs) you must be smoking your stock often. Maybe the decision to get in this dead end business was made under influence.


Oh, you mean the business I sold at a huge profit before the industry dried up? I guess its going fine as I am still getting my dividend payments.

Is there anything else you don't know jack shit about and want to expand upon?

California's ban resulted in a 70% reduction in plastic bags found on beaches. I guess banning them is a bad idea though because it didn't cure the oil crisis or air pollution.

http://theconversation.com/the-plastic-waste-crisis-is-an-opportunity-for-the-us-to-get-serious-about-recycling-at-home-93254

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Matt V

Since 26 Oct 2014
377 Posts
Summer- OR Coast, Winter - My van near good snow
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PostTue May 21, 19 3:28 pm     Reply with quote

wylieflyote wrote:

Here in Tacoma we've had just wonderful curb-side recycling for decades. Super easy. But, We received word that this is a thing of the past without more taxation. China has been taking all our recycling (and probably all of yours) for many years and has told the world No More without drastic price increases. I also did not realize until reading China's statement just how dirty our recycled plastic as and what problems that causes.


So you do realize that the entire American public was completely fleeced for decades with regards to our recyclables being turned into new products, right?

But the big story is yet to come out. Once somebody does the math on the additional pollution caused by the fake recycling program in comparison to just putting it directly into a partially environmentally sound landfill in the western world with out the false narrative, maybe environmentalists will wake up to their past and current mistakes. Not bloody likely, though.

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Last edited by Matt V on Tue May 21, 19 3:33 pm; edited 1 time in total

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